Comments on: Hospitality Exchange Communities and real-life campaigns

By: Fabzgy

Fabzgy — Mon, 24 Mar 2008 15:59:01 +0000

Okay, looks like the idealistic people I deal mostly with in the networks are not the majority.

@ zack0r: Do you really think the capitalistc way of organizing our society is the best way for humanity? I met recently a bunch of people comming down to Bocas del Torro, Panama for Spring break. Celebrating there week of with tons of beer, cocaine, weed, etc.

Once we entered in a discussion about free licenses, copyright, patents, etc. they started to praise the capitalistic system which allows them to fly 3500 miles and get high for an entire week without even recognizing that the people around them are fuckin poor. Then they are starting to bargain down the prizes for food, acomodation, transport, clothes, handicrafts etc.

It s a wonderfull system if you live on the “right” side, isn t it?

By: Margaret

Margaret — Tue, 18 Mar 2008 14:28:13 +0000

Kasper there you are! now boys…where are your seatbelts, hmmm?

By: Kasper Souren

Kasper Souren — Mon, 17 Mar 2008 22:45:24 +0000

@zak0r: Madonna seems to survive pretty well. I’ve also seen a lot of hairdressers doing not too bad.

@Margaret: I rather travel in a less homogeneous way myself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls7tPhXM2mE

By: Margaret

Margaret — Mon, 17 Mar 2008 20:51:13 +0000

I think it’s interesting that exactly no one would like our transportation systems to be run in this way Fabzgy, given that they are of course essential to the hospex and travel industries. We all seem to like homogenization and uniformity when applied to how airplanes, trains and cars are built and operated.

By: zak0r

zak0r — Mon, 17 Mar 2008 20:33:49 +0000

what a bunch of hippie bullshit.
an unproductive society is just not going to travel in the first place since they cant afford it. remove money or whatever, you still have the same common principle of exchange of services or goods or favours. money and the open market is just the abstraction of this.

honestly, if anything should be promoted on hospitality exchange networks, it shouldnt be how to be more of an inefficient illusional dimwit, but how to actually walk the walk. talk is cheap, yet its all you see, read and hear, whilst those who are actually working are sponsoring this junk.
keep in mind, you cant survive from cutting each others hair and singing.

By: Christopher Culver

Christopher Culver — Sun, 16 Mar 2008 18:27:00 +0000

radiotonix, when I’ve had to stay in a hostel when I travel because I couldn’t find a host in time, I’ve asked hostel owners about whether they’ve felt any impact from hospitality networks. They say no, since there are always people who would rather pay for the convenience of not having to socialize all the time with their hosts: young couples who want privacy in the bedroom, people who go partying and come back at late hours, people who just want some time alone.

So far hostels are, for better or worse, still doing fine.

By: radiotonix

radiotonix — Sun, 16 Mar 2008 13:46:45 +0000

I`m always very skeptical towards the glorification of voluntary work.
I think voluntary work fits very well in a capitalist logic which is based on a huge amount of unpaid or underpaid work.

Nobody will be able to pay for his food and living costs by doing voluntary work. It also produces a lot of dependency from other people. Work for free might be out of good intentions. But if it is going to be more widespread, it will have an influence on the economy.

Just an example: A member of BeWelcome is an employee in a guesthouse too. The member likes to host people at his apartment (i see hosting as voluntary work too). In the small town, where the member lives, more and more visitors are going to use BeWelcome instead of a hostel or a small guesthouse. The local tourism economy will lose the possibility to earn money and pay the employee. The guesthouse will have to release employees. And our BW-Member who hasn`t a job anymore will lose his possibility to pay his apartment. Well, he still is a BW member and can travel all around the world and don`t need money to pay for accommodation, but he is dependent from people who can pay for an apartment.

By: Kasper Souren

Kasper Souren — Sun, 16 Mar 2008 11:33:07 +0000

An interesting point of view, Fabzgy. However, I think it would not be wise for BeVolunteer to take an explicit anti-capitalist stance. Of course, there are many members who feel this way about the state of the world. I am still very sympathetic to this view myself. On the other hand, I don’t think capitalism is completely bad. It is unclear, for instance, if we would have had the cheap hardware and the capability to communicate on this large scale if it weren’t for the competition forced upon the producers of hardware.

Also, sharing (which is our, excusez le mot, business in a broad sense I presume) can more easily be extended in affluent societies. There is more waste and hence more potential for turning waste into happiness and freedom, e.g. supermarket throw-outs and empty car seats into dumpster dived dinner parties and modes of free ad-hoc transport.

Besides, BeVolunteer taking position in this debate could alienate members and keep them away from participation. I don’t think taking a this stance is a requirement to working on changing society in a radical way. Au contraire, it’s healthy to keep options open and to not exclude technology and ideas and even opportunities. Diversification is a strength. If you want to change something it’s good to work from within and without (just like we did as volunteers and (gradually more and more) dissidents for CouchSurfing).

I see the free software community as the first social movement that was successful in occupying a place at the center of modern-day capitalism. Billions are invested in the creation of means of production (software) that are available and accessible to anyone. This would have never happened if the General Public License had been even slightly anti-capitalist. The launch of the term “open source” in order to not scare way CEOs and VCs has been often criticized and even though I personally prefer to ally myself with the free software movement, the Open Source Initiative was just another act of sheer genius that has probably taken a big role to get us where we are now.

Now it’s time to build upon this and use these means, opportunities and momentum, in groups and organizations (and even companies) that can increase the

The irony of the situation is that the vision of the founders of Hospitality Club and CouchSurfing never went beyond personal power and control. However, this behavior has only lost us a couple of years and we have gained a lot of invaluable insight in the dynamics of power and egos.