Comments on: Round up http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/ The campaign for a truly open CouchSurfing organisation Fri, 23 Jul 2010 21:48:36 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Mojo Doppio http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-6041 Mojo Doppio Tue, 12 Feb 2008 20:33:38 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-6041 My feeling about Casey wanting to "own" the code, was that he's a scheming weasel who always intended to personally benefit from the blood, sweat, and tears of people who were hoping to build a great organization, and certainly not for (practically) the sole benefit of Casey Fenton. FWIW, I saw things heading this way slightly before the NDA meltdown, but I was very pleased to see so many talented coders refuse to accept the leg irons and gags. My feeling about Casey wanting to “own” the code, was that he’s a scheming weasel who always intended to personally benefit from the blood, sweat, and tears of people who were hoping to build a great organization, and certainly not for (practically) the sole benefit of Casey Fenton. FWIW, I saw things heading this way slightly before the NDA meltdown, but I was very pleased to see so many talented coders refuse to accept the leg irons and gags.

]]> By: Pissed http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-147 Pissed Thu, 17 May 2007 09:55:50 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-147 An open letter to Naz: Sounds like you are some retard who did a couple a law papers for your Business studies and now think you're a friggin' lawyer. 1. "Consideration is a contractual term at law and has no place in this discussion." Well, guess what retard - an NDA is a contract. 2. "Basically, either you trust Casey and the rest of the CS guys or you don't. Decide." So it's OK for Casey and the Leadership Klan to NOT trust devs? 3. It could be written on toilet paper and read "Oh behave baby!" but if it bears your signature, then you have indicated that a) You will behave and b) You have no problem with Casey referring to you as "baby". It creates a pre-existing relationship that implicitly creates a heightened legal duty of care." This is super-retarded. A contract is not enforceable without consideration, you idiot. Stop copy & pasting stuff from wikipedia that you don't understand. Seriously Naz, are you socially retarded? First you show complete disrespect for a CORE member of CouchSurfing. You have been a member for what 6 months? Are you trying to kiss your way up to the Leadership Circle? Bet you're REAL popular in the dev team, now. Also the NDA is a moral issue. Something you obviously know nothing about. CouchSurfing was supposed to be about making the world a better place - for everyone, not just CouchSurfing members. That's why people first volunteered. That's why they are now pissed and quiting. CouchSurfing is now becoming just another example of American corporate collonialism. CouchSurfing REALLY needs more "know-it-all retards" like you. Sheesh. An open letter to Naz:

Sounds like you are some retard who did a couple a law papers for your Business studies and now think you’re a friggin’ lawyer.

1. “Consideration is a contractual term at law and has no place in this discussion.”

Well, guess what retard – an NDA is a contract.

2. “Basically, either you trust Casey and the rest of the CS guys or you don’t. Decide.”

So it’s OK for Casey and the Leadership Klan to NOT trust devs?

3. It could be written on toilet paper and read “Oh behave baby!” but if it bears your signature, then you have indicated that a) You will behave and b) You have no problem with Casey referring to you as “baby”. It creates a pre-existing relationship that implicitly creates a heightened legal duty of care.”

This is super-retarded. A contract is not enforceable without consideration, you idiot. Stop copy & pasting stuff from wikipedia that you don’t understand.

Seriously Naz, are you socially retarded?
First you show complete disrespect for a CORE member of CouchSurfing. You have been a member for what 6 months? Are you trying to kiss your way up to the Leadership Circle? Bet you’re REAL popular in the dev team, now.

Also the NDA is a moral issue. Something you obviously know nothing about. CouchSurfing was supposed to be about making the world a better place – for everyone, not just CouchSurfing members. That’s why people first volunteered. That’s why they are now pissed and quiting. CouchSurfing is now becoming just another example of American corporate collonialism.

CouchSurfing REALLY needs more “know-it-all retards” like you. Sheesh.

]]> By: Florian http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-146 Florian Thu, 17 May 2007 08:47:54 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-146 Wow, what A LOT of effort you guys put in trying to raise awareness and change things to a more open and democratic style! Some of you might know that a similar development took place with Hospitality Club about 1 year ago. The official missions of CS, HC are very nice but as a volunteer some of us spend so many hours and energy on unpaid work that the least thing to expect would be that this work is respected and that the volunteers are treated fairly: that it is fun to contribute to the project. Nobody is perfect and maybe the more people work together the more imperfect a project becomes. As long as we are aware of it we might simply learn out of mistakes. Guys, I am really sorry to find all your effort leading to nowhere (or at least not to where you hoped) and I can only encourage you to take a step back and look at CS and HC and think about how the future of a real volunteer network should look different to them. Many things you fought for with open.cs you will find already implemented in BeVolunteer. But this is only the beginning. Working together and respecting each other also means that as members it is YOU to suggest, discuss and implement changes. Ask as much as you want - we will not get tired of answering because we were once where you are now. A big BeWelcome! Be welcome to build a project with us - and do it in a friendly way :) Wow, what A LOT of effort you guys put in trying to raise awareness and change things to a more open and democratic style!
Some of you might know that a similar development took place with Hospitality Club about 1 year ago.

The official missions of CS, HC are very nice but as a volunteer some of us spend so many hours and energy on unpaid work that the least thing to expect would be that this work is respected and that the volunteers are treated fairly: that it is fun to contribute to the project.
Nobody is perfect and maybe the more people work together the more imperfect a project becomes. As long as we are aware of it we might simply learn out of mistakes.

Guys, I am really sorry to find all your effort leading to nowhere (or at least not to where you hoped) and I can only encourage you to take a step back and look at CS and HC and think about how the future of a real volunteer network should look different to them. Many things you fought for with open.cs you will find already implemented in BeVolunteer. But this is only the beginning. Working together and respecting each other also means that as members it is YOU to suggest, discuss and implement changes. Ask as much as you want – we will not get tired of answering because we were once where you are now. A big BeWelcome! Be welcome to build a project with us – and do it in a friendly way :)

]]> By: roy http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-145 roy Thu, 17 May 2007 08:46:08 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-145 Such a shame. CouchSurfing has the potential to do something wonderful as a community. But it feels like it is shifting to just be a service. It feels like the new mission is "intercultural understanding, the American way". The Volunteer Agreement smells like some sort of Patriot Act initiative to protect against other websites with Weapons of Mass Hospitality. However once people have made a paradigm shift (from community to service) people will continue to happily use CS. Sort of like using Craigslist.com. But I wonder if CS can really afford to run on a barebones tech team? Perhaps to complete this transformation, CS will start having advertising and hired staff. Such a shame. CouchSurfing has the potential to do something wonderful as a community.

But it feels like it is shifting to just be a service. It feels like the new mission is “intercultural understanding, the American way”. The Volunteer Agreement smells like some sort of Patriot Act initiative to protect against other websites with Weapons of Mass Hospitality.

However once people have made a paradigm shift (from community to service) people will continue to happily use CS. Sort of like using Craigslist.com.

But I wonder if CS can really afford to run on a barebones tech team? Perhaps to complete this transformation, CS will start having advertising and hired staff.

]]> By: vvas http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-131 vvas Wed, 16 May 2007 18:04:38 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-131 K., This is fortunately a thing of the past. Thanks to the efforts of John / matrixpoint (who has just resigned from the dev team too) and a few of us that provided feedback, a new sorting algorithm is in effect for search results, which is simple, effective in its goals, and most importantly its operation is public knowledge. Check out the "CouchSearch sorting" group: http://www.couchsurfing.com/group.html?gid=5110 As for the old algorithm, I honestly don't want to know what went on in there. I can only assume it is fairly ugly. Regards, Vasilis K.,

This is fortunately a thing of the past. Thanks to the efforts of John / matrixpoint (who has just resigned from the dev team too) and a few of us that provided feedback, a new sorting algorithm is in effect for search results, which is simple, effective in its goals, and most importantly its operation is public knowledge. Check out the “CouchSearch sorting” group:

http://www.couchsurfing.com/group.html?gid=5110

As for the old algorithm, I honestly don’t want to know what went on in there. I can only assume it is fairly ugly.

Regards,
Vasilis

]]> By: K. http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-130 K. Wed, 16 May 2007 17:47:50 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-130 Talking of transparency, there is something fishy about how users appear in search results, esp. in San Francisco where the "circle" is based. Its inconsistent and till a month ago, my name would not appear in people offering a couch(even after narrowing down age group and going through top 100 results) though I have been a verified member for few months and had references too. I only discovered it when I realized that I get requests through HC but never through CS and I asked a friend who is a CS member to test by searching for couches in SF. Also, people in "circle"'s network, ie. friends or friends of friends, would consistently appear as top results (No filter like "vouched for" etc. was selected). Talking of transparency, there is something fishy about how users appear in search results, esp. in San Francisco where the “circle” is based. Its inconsistent and till a month ago, my name would not appear in people offering a couch(even after narrowing down age group and going through top 100 results) though I have been a verified member for few months and had references too.
I only discovered it when I realized that I get requests through HC but never through CS and I asked a friend who is a CS member to test
by searching for couches in SF.
Also, people in “circle”’s network, ie. friends or friends of friends, would consistently appear as top results (No filter like “vouched for” etc. was selected).

]]> By: Chris Burley http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-125 Chris Burley Wed, 16 May 2007 16:01:31 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-125 Thomas, thank you sincerely for this reply. I appreciate you taking the time to summarize all that you think happened. I am going to agree to disagree that "OCS failed miserably in its goals". That kind of language is just defeatist and I expect more from a group as talented as you guys. I would hope you realize that things have been accelerated, that asses have been kicked and people are being held accountable. I can't vouch for the rest of our leaders group, but I personally stand for creating a better organization and I believe openness and transparency and accountability are three major pillars we could improve upon. Thank you sincerely Thomas, we appreciate all the effort you've put into this campaign. Thomas, thank you sincerely for this reply. I appreciate you taking the time to summarize all that you think happened. I am going to agree to disagree that “OCS failed miserably in its goals”. That kind of language is just defeatist and I expect more from a group as talented as you guys.

I would hope you realize that things have been accelerated, that asses have been kicked and people are being held accountable. I can’t vouch for the rest of our leaders group, but I personally stand for creating a better organization and I believe openness and transparency and accountability are three major pillars we could improve upon.

Thank you sincerely Thomas, we appreciate all the effort you’ve put into this campaign.

]]> By: isa http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-123 isa Wed, 16 May 2007 14:08:18 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-123 be welcome at be welcome: it is written in to be open and be accountable and to be democratic and to be community... it really is a place to be welcome and to be a volunteer of the people by the people and for the people, liberty, equality, fraternity... and all the good stuff. love and peace and happy trails isa be welcome at be welcome: it is written in to be open and be accountable and to be democratic and to be community…

it really is a place to be welcome and to be a volunteer of the people by the people and for the people, liberty, equality, fraternity… and all the good stuff.

love and peace and happy trails

isa

]]> By: guaka http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/comment-page-1/#comment-122 guaka Wed, 16 May 2007 12:50:12 +0000 http://www.opencouchsurfing.org/2007/05/16/round-up/#comment-122 Today I spent some time unsubscribing from some CS groups, removing my own access to some CS stuff, such as the wiki. I just got access to the http://bevolunteer.org wiki, and, well, it's rad, people. 13 out of 13 devs voted to release its code under the GPL, the remaining questions are just "how?" and "when?". There is a Board of Directors, with NINE members, who have been elected by the 40 (and counting...) official volunteers. All in all, it feels like a very welcoming place! Today I spent some time unsubscribing from some CS groups, removing my own access to some CS stuff, such as the wiki.

I just got access to the http://bevolunteer.org wiki, and, well, it’s rad, people. 13 out of 13 devs voted to release its code under the GPL, the remaining questions are just “how?” and “when?”.

There is a Board of Directors, with NINE members, who have been elected by the 40 (and counting…) official volunteers.

All in all, it feels like a very welcoming place!

]]>